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	<title>Comments on: Bringing Rapid Transit to Detroit</title>
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		<title>By: Woody</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/03/16/bringing-rapid-transit-to-detroit/#comment-27855</link>
		<dc:creator>Woody</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Feb 2010 00:35:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=1684#comment-27855</guid>
		<description>Detroit is a massive case of &quot;blame the victim.&quot;

In the boom years after World War II, they had a saying about Detroit: &quot;Every ni@@er in the city had worked a year in the auto industry. Just one year.&quot; 

That&#039;s because the big employers, under the UAW Contract, had to make temp workers permanent after 90 days on the job. So &quot;LeRoy&quot; worked 89 days at General Motors, then 89 days at Ford, 89 days at Chrysler, maybe another 89 days at a big parts maker. And then he was finished. 

Blacks never forgot and never forgave their treatment, and the anger exploded into urban riots in the 1960s. The seething anger continues to manifest in a &quot;quiet riot&quot; of drinking and drugging, street crime, and bad attitude. 

Of course, the city&#039;s white people were quick to forget how they benefitted from the favored treatment under American&#039;s own Apartheid rules. When the blacks grew restless, waves of &#039;white flight&#039; took them into the surrounding suburbs that were de facto segregated in schools, housing, and job opportunities. Blacks found it very very difficult to find a job or a home outside the increasingly ghettoized city.

Meanwhile state funds went to projects and programs in white jurisdictions, with always less for Detroit. Even Wayne State was punished for being surrounded by black people, while love was lavished on the U of Michigan and Michigan State.

The inner city -- or was it the i@@er city? -- was physically walled off and prevented from growing by its noose of bordering suburbs. Generally in America, cities able to annex along their borders could grow their tax base and thrive-- see Columbus, Houston/Austin/San Antonio, Jacksonville, and Oklahoma City compared to places like Baltimore, Pittsburgh, Cleveland, and New Orleans, where the metro areas remain strong while the core city is weak.The sorry story is maybe worse if you look at other severely ghettoized cities like Newark and Camden, Gary or St Louis. 

LBJ tried to do something serious to end poverty and official racism, but since then no President has wasted much effort on that stuff. Certainly since the &quot;Southern Strategy&quot; and the election of 1980, it&#039;s often seemed that this country is being governed not from Washington, D.C. so much as from the first capital of the Confederacy, Montgomery, Alabama. 

What a blanking surprise that Detroit&#039;s inner city sank into decay. 

Now some good folks want to build a light rail line linking the city&#039;s major institutions, the downtown, the ball parks, the big museums, the university, even the Amtrak station, much on the order of Houston&#039;s Main Street Line, the most successful urban rail project in this decade. God bless &#039;em. Maybe it will work, maybe not. But as far as I can see, nobody else has a better plan to try to help.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Detroit is a massive case of &#8220;blame the victim.&#8221;</p>
<p>In the boom years after World War II, they had a saying about Detroit: &#8220;Every ni@@er in the city had worked a year in the auto industry. Just one year.&#8221; </p>
<p>That&#8217;s because the big employers, under the UAW Contract, had to make temp workers permanent after 90 days on the job. So &#8220;LeRoy&#8221; worked 89 days at General Motors, then 89 days at Ford, 89 days at Chrysler, maybe another 89 days at a big parts maker. And then he was finished. </p>
<p>Blacks never forgot and never forgave their treatment, and the anger exploded into urban riots in the 1960s. The seething anger continues to manifest in a &#8220;quiet riot&#8221; of drinking and drugging, street crime, and bad attitude. </p>
<p>Of course, the city&#8217;s white people were quick to forget how they benefitted from the favored treatment under American&#8217;s own Apartheid rules. When the blacks grew restless, waves of &#8216;white flight&#8217; took them into the surrounding suburbs that were de facto segregated in schools, housing, and job opportunities. Blacks found it very very difficult to find a job or a home outside the increasingly ghettoized city.</p>
<p>Meanwhile state funds went to projects and programs in white jurisdictions, with always less for Detroit. Even Wayne State was punished for being surrounded by black people, while love was lavished on the U of Michigan and Michigan State.</p>
<p>The inner city &#8212; or was it the i@@er city? &#8212; was physically walled off and prevented from growing by its noose of bordering suburbs. Generally in America, cities able to annex along their borders could grow their tax base and thrive&#8211; see Columbus, Houston/Austin/San Antonio, Jacksonville, and Oklahoma City compared to places like Baltimore, Pittsburgh, Cleveland, and New Orleans, where the metro areas remain strong while the core city is weak.The sorry story is maybe worse if you look at other severely ghettoized cities like Newark and Camden, Gary or St Louis. </p>
<p>LBJ tried to do something serious to end poverty and official racism, but since then no President has wasted much effort on that stuff. Certainly since the &#8220;Southern Strategy&#8221; and the election of 1980, it&#8217;s often seemed that this country is being governed not from Washington, D.C. so much as from the first capital of the Confederacy, Montgomery, Alabama. </p>
<p>What a blanking surprise that Detroit&#8217;s inner city sank into decay. </p>
<p>Now some good folks want to build a light rail line linking the city&#8217;s major institutions, the downtown, the ball parks, the big museums, the university, even the Amtrak station, much on the order of Houston&#8217;s Main Street Line, the most successful urban rail project in this decade. God bless &#8216;em. Maybe it will work, maybe not. But as far as I can see, nobody else has a better plan to try to help.</p>
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		<title>By: Nicole - Urban Planner Detroit</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/03/16/bringing-rapid-transit-to-detroit/#comment-27827</link>
		<dc:creator>Nicole - Urban Planner Detroit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Feb 2010 19:57:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=1684#comment-27827</guid>
		<description>For Detroit the facts are obvious to the world. There is no secret holder, Detroit is in a rough position economically in terms of population, industry, and financially. I am not sticking up for the City and acting oblivious to the facts, but for being such an educated man this article rages a tone of negativity around a City that is maxed with rich history and that has contributed to the creation of so many elements of the &quot;American way&quot;.  (8 hour work day and the automobile industry etc.) Pretty sad when your articles depict opinion and not fact and your walking around with a degree from Yale.  

&quot;Should such a city even attempt to continue existing?&quot;

Well....it&#039;s about how you chose to live not where you live. 

(Yonah Freemark is an independent researcher currently working in France on comparative urban development as part of a Gordon Grand Fellowship from Yale University, from which he graduated in May 2008 with a BA in architecture. He writes about transportation and land use issues for The Transport Politic and The Infrastructurist)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For Detroit the facts are obvious to the world. There is no secret holder, Detroit is in a rough position economically in terms of population, industry, and financially. I am not sticking up for the City and acting oblivious to the facts, but for being such an educated man this article rages a tone of negativity around a City that is maxed with rich history and that has contributed to the creation of so many elements of the &#8220;American way&#8221;.  (8 hour work day and the automobile industry etc.) Pretty sad when your articles depict opinion and not fact and your walking around with a degree from Yale.  </p>
<p>&#8220;Should such a city even attempt to continue existing?&#8221;</p>
<p>Well&#8230;.it&#8217;s about how you chose to live not where you live. </p>
<p>(Yonah Freemark is an independent researcher currently working in France on comparative urban development as part of a Gordon Grand Fellowship from Yale University, from which he graduated in May 2008 with a BA in architecture. He writes about transportation and land use issues for The Transport Politic and The Infrastructurist)</p>
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		<title>By: Gary Provenzano</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/03/16/bringing-rapid-transit-to-detroit/#comment-726</link>
		<dc:creator>Gary Provenzano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Mar 2009 19:17:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=1684#comment-726</guid>
		<description>I think that some kind of commuter rail service is necessary to get Detroit back on the map. Everyone says the same thing when it comes to big ticket events. -- Transportation. -- Plus there could be fewer cars on the road and fewer serious and even fatal accidents. And if they had commuter rail service to get from Metro Airport to Downtown Detroit, I &#039;d go back and see my reletives every year without the cost of a car rental saving me about $500 each trip.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that some kind of commuter rail service is necessary to get Detroit back on the map. Everyone says the same thing when it comes to big ticket events. &#8212; Transportation. &#8212; Plus there could be fewer cars on the road and fewer serious and even fatal accidents. And if they had commuter rail service to get from Metro Airport to Downtown Detroit, I &#8216;d go back and see my reletives every year without the cost of a car rental saving me about $500 each trip.</p>
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		<title>By: anon.</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/03/16/bringing-rapid-transit-to-detroit/#comment-725</link>
		<dc:creator>anon.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Mar 2009 04:45:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=1684#comment-725</guid>
		<description>In Detroit, the first thing they need is sound management.  Perhaps something like the Youngstown 2020 Plan would do the trick -- if enough of the city (buildings, roads, pipes) were demolished and replaced with parkland it would be much less expensive to maintain (city services) and much more attractive.  But you&#039;re not going to get that from a city with government like Detroit&#039;s.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In Detroit, the first thing they need is sound management.  Perhaps something like the Youngstown 2020 Plan would do the trick &#8212; if enough of the city (buildings, roads, pipes) were demolished and replaced with parkland it would be much less expensive to maintain (city services) and much more attractive.  But you&#8217;re not going to get that from a city with government like Detroit&#8217;s.</p>
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		<title>By: Mykel Cox</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/03/16/bringing-rapid-transit-to-detroit/#comment-724</link>
		<dc:creator>Mykel Cox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Mar 2009 02:36:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=1684#comment-724</guid>
		<description>Okay so what I see happening is....the light rail will get funded and they will lay down the first 3.5 miles of it. Then because of how cheap the land is gonna be around it, it will be prime for developers because right now its all about making walkable cities so businesses and residential will be develloped and redeveloped all along the line and due to how cheap these parcels are it will allow more money for constuction.  Then after it starts a &quot;trickle&quot; into the immedate neighborhoods then the next set of tracks will be laid out to the fairgrounds and onward to Pontiac with the same deveoplment/redevelopment extending all the way down Woodward.

Then they will start on the other 13 corridors. Companies will base themselves here close to the light rail line growing the economy and though its gonna take years to reverse the damage here eventually the city will be revitalized. The transit is gonna be key and the diverse attitudes of the citizens and local leaders are going to be key.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okay so what I see happening is&#8230;.the light rail will get funded and they will lay down the first 3.5 miles of it. Then because of how cheap the land is gonna be around it, it will be prime for developers because right now its all about making walkable cities so businesses and residential will be develloped and redeveloped all along the line and due to how cheap these parcels are it will allow more money for constuction.  Then after it starts a &#8220;trickle&#8221; into the immedate neighborhoods then the next set of tracks will be laid out to the fairgrounds and onward to Pontiac with the same deveoplment/redevelopment extending all the way down Woodward.</p>
<p>Then they will start on the other 13 corridors. Companies will base themselves here close to the light rail line growing the economy and though its gonna take years to reverse the damage here eventually the city will be revitalized. The transit is gonna be key and the diverse attitudes of the citizens and local leaders are going to be key.</p>
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		<title>By: Alon Levy</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/03/16/bringing-rapid-transit-to-detroit/#comment-723</link>
		<dc:creator>Alon Levy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 03:29:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=1684#comment-723</guid>
		<description>There&#039;s already a &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michigan_Central_Railway_Tunnel&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;two-track tunnel&lt;/a&gt; between Detroit and Windsor. It&#039;s used only by freight, but in principle the cities could fund a passenger shuttle.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s already a <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michigan_Central_Railway_Tunnel" rel="nofollow">two-track tunnel</a> between Detroit and Windsor. It&#8217;s used only by freight, but in principle the cities could fund a passenger shuttle.</p>
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		<title>By: jon</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/03/16/bringing-rapid-transit-to-detroit/#comment-722</link>
		<dc:creator>jon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Mar 2009 02:20:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=1684#comment-722</guid>
		<description>it would be great if the line could continue under the river in a tunnel to windsor and have a single secure &quot;international&quot; station in canada where people go through customs between the platform and street. of course getting a line under the river would also require a subway under downtown detroit (in order to get under the river), not that downtown detroit warrants a subway with its oversized lightly trafficed streets.

Detroit can surprise you though, as mentioned it has some of the most incredible pieces of architecture in the US and just recently they built one of the best new public spaces in the US, Campus Martius Park.

While Detroit has always been low density and very suburban focused, it does have a handful of major radial streets running out of downtown (against the grid) which are ideal as major transit corridors. The proposed New Center - Downtown line hits pretty much everything of signifigance in Detroit, just about everything else outside this route is abandoned or very underutilized. This is the one route in Detroit that does really make sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>it would be great if the line could continue under the river in a tunnel to windsor and have a single secure &#8220;international&#8221; station in canada where people go through customs between the platform and street. of course getting a line under the river would also require a subway under downtown detroit (in order to get under the river), not that downtown detroit warrants a subway with its oversized lightly trafficed streets.</p>
<p>Detroit can surprise you though, as mentioned it has some of the most incredible pieces of architecture in the US and just recently they built one of the best new public spaces in the US, Campus Martius Park.</p>
<p>While Detroit has always been low density and very suburban focused, it does have a handful of major radial streets running out of downtown (against the grid) which are ideal as major transit corridors. The proposed New Center &#8211; Downtown line hits pretty much everything of signifigance in Detroit, just about everything else outside this route is abandoned or very underutilized. This is the one route in Detroit that does really make sense.</p>
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		<title>By: JP</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/03/16/bringing-rapid-transit-to-detroit/#comment-721</link>
		<dc:creator>JP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 20:32:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=1684#comment-721</guid>
		<description>I have to agree with AlexB on the bummer of a post.  I don&#039;t think anyone knows what to do with Detroit.  There&#039;s no tax base, you can buy a house for less than a new car, not enough good jobs left.

When I went to some Tigers games, back in grad school, I could not believe the beauty of the city and its buildings.  Too bad there&#039;s a tree growing wild in the atrium, but still very beautiful.  Let Detroit rot, the Big Three and all their Michigan enablers made this bed, let them lie in it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to agree with AlexB on the bummer of a post.  I don&#8217;t think anyone knows what to do with Detroit.  There&#8217;s no tax base, you can buy a house for less than a new car, not enough good jobs left.</p>
<p>When I went to some Tigers games, back in grad school, I could not believe the beauty of the city and its buildings.  Too bad there&#8217;s a tree growing wild in the atrium, but still very beautiful.  Let Detroit rot, the Big Three and all their Michigan enablers made this bed, let them lie in it.</p>
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		<title>By: AlexB</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/03/16/bringing-rapid-transit-to-detroit/#comment-720</link>
		<dc:creator>AlexB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 18:44:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=1684#comment-720</guid>
		<description>Wow, what a bummer of a post.  You know it&#039;s bad when a pro-transit blog it asking if it&#039;s even worth it to build light rail.  It seems like Detroit could use some commuter rail more than light rail, to bring the wealthy suburbanites into the city center.  Detroit must have a legacy of rail lines all over the place.  The city may be on the down and out, but it&#039;s not going to disappear anytime soon.  You have to start somewhere, right?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, what a bummer of a post.  You know it&#8217;s bad when a pro-transit blog it asking if it&#8217;s even worth it to build light rail.  It seems like Detroit could use some commuter rail more than light rail, to bring the wealthy suburbanites into the city center.  Detroit must have a legacy of rail lines all over the place.  The city may be on the down and out, but it&#8217;s not going to disappear anytime soon.  You have to start somewhere, right?</p>
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		<title>By: Design New Haven</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/03/16/bringing-rapid-transit-to-detroit/#comment-718</link>
		<dc:creator>Design New Haven</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 15:23:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=1684#comment-718</guid>
		<description>Detroit may seem &quot;finished&quot; now, but once gas hits $8 per gallon, things will flip pretty quickly.  I&#039;ve talked with many Detroit residents who would consider moving back to the center of Detroit if it had a grocery store.

Once the tipping point is reached, I predict that investment will flood back into the center.  Even over the past few years, you were seeing a significant amount of private investment in the Midtown area.  Light rail via Woodward could help enormously, if it was properly designed and integrated with better bike/ped facilities.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Detroit may seem &#8220;finished&#8221; now, but once gas hits $8 per gallon, things will flip pretty quickly.  I&#8217;ve talked with many Detroit residents who would consider moving back to the center of Detroit if it had a grocery store.</p>
<p>Once the tipping point is reached, I predict that investment will flood back into the center.  Even over the past few years, you were seeing a significant amount of private investment in the Midtown area.  Light rail via Woodward could help enormously, if it was properly designed and integrated with better bike/ped facilities.</p>
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