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	<title>Comments on: Electrification Suddenly in Vogue Again</title>
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	<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/06/18/electrification-suddenly-in-vogue-again/</link>
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		<title>By: Ocean Railroader</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/06/18/electrification-suddenly-in-vogue-again/#comment-11195</link>
		<dc:creator>Ocean Railroader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Oct 2009 04:40:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=2459#comment-11195</guid>
		<description>The Pennsyvinia Catenary lines that run from from New York to Washingiton get there power from a major hydro Dam on the Susacahanna River and what they could do is convert more of the power generators at that dam from house hold power sales to railroad power sales and add a few extra power lines and have then ship power to the proposed catenary line extensions.

There was talks of extending the Pennsyvinia Catenary masts and lines to Pittsburg in the 1930&#039;s we should dust off those old plans and extend the lines that way first and then extend the lines south to Pettersburg Virginia. The classic catenary masts have a good plan built into them with their top rows of trassmision wires that would allow them to take on power at a wind farm or a solar farm or a hyro station and ship it to substations along the lines.


There is also something sad to that I noice in Pennsyvinia along the Susahanna River there is a mainline railroad with Pennsyvinia Catenary masts and all the masts are still standing but are stipped off their wires meaning that they don&#039;t run off eletric anymore. Also in Lancaster PA there is a rail line that follows US Route 30 that has catenary masts but they were stipped of their wires. We could easly restore eletric power to these lines by adding new catenary wires to the masts that are missing their wires.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Pennsyvinia Catenary lines that run from from New York to Washingiton get there power from a major hydro Dam on the Susacahanna River and what they could do is convert more of the power generators at that dam from house hold power sales to railroad power sales and add a few extra power lines and have then ship power to the proposed catenary line extensions.</p>
<p>There was talks of extending the Pennsyvinia Catenary masts and lines to Pittsburg in the 1930&#8217;s we should dust off those old plans and extend the lines that way first and then extend the lines south to Pettersburg Virginia. The classic catenary masts have a good plan built into them with their top rows of trassmision wires that would allow them to take on power at a wind farm or a solar farm or a hyro station and ship it to substations along the lines.</p>
<p>There is also something sad to that I noice in Pennsyvinia along the Susahanna River there is a mainline railroad with Pennsyvinia Catenary masts and all the masts are still standing but are stipped off their wires meaning that they don&#8217;t run off eletric anymore. Also in Lancaster PA there is a rail line that follows US Route 30 that has catenary masts but they were stipped of their wires. We could easly restore eletric power to these lines by adding new catenary wires to the masts that are missing their wires.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael Tenenbaum, PE</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/06/18/electrification-suddenly-in-vogue-again/#comment-3445</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael Tenenbaum, PE</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Aug 2009 13:57:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=2459#comment-3445</guid>
		<description>Nathanael, could you imagine all the egos that were at stake 100 years ago when each railroad CEO believed he had the better idea for electrification?

Recently our company completed work for a descendant of Commodore Vanderbilt.  All I can tell you about that experience is that the same insanity and substance abuse behind the under-running third rail and all the insanity in the bloodline that followed continues to the present day!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nathanael, could you imagine all the egos that were at stake 100 years ago when each railroad CEO believed he had the better idea for electrification?</p>
<p>Recently our company completed work for a descendant of Commodore Vanderbilt.  All I can tell you about that experience is that the same insanity and substance abuse behind the under-running third rail and all the insanity in the bloodline that followed continues to the present day!</p>
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		<title>By: Nathanael</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/06/18/electrification-suddenly-in-vogue-again/#comment-1634</link>
		<dc:creator>Nathanael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 26 Jun 2009 18:47:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=2459#comment-1634</guid>
		<description>The Empire Connection suffers from incompatible electrification systems.  Metro-North uses under-running third rail DC, LIRR uses top-running third rail DC, and Amtrak/NJT/SEPTA use AC overhead wires.

To run on both the Hudson Line electrification and the Penn Station electrification, an Amtrak locomotive would either need &quot;flip-shoes&quot; (simple) or (more complicated, but better long term) both a shoe and a pantograph and both AC and DC transformers.  This is frankly a good idea but it&#039;s tied up in failure to order new locomotives for Amtrak.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Empire Connection suffers from incompatible electrification systems.  Metro-North uses under-running third rail DC, LIRR uses top-running third rail DC, and Amtrak/NJT/SEPTA use AC overhead wires.</p>
<p>To run on both the Hudson Line electrification and the Penn Station electrification, an Amtrak locomotive would either need &#8220;flip-shoes&#8221; (simple) or (more complicated, but better long term) both a shoe and a pantograph and both AC and DC transformers.  This is frankly a good idea but it&#8217;s tied up in failure to order new locomotives for Amtrak.</p>
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		<title>By: Alon Levy</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/06/18/electrification-suddenly-in-vogue-again/#comment-1633</link>
		<dc:creator>Alon Levy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jun 2009 17:32:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=2459#comment-1633</guid>
		<description>The stupidest part about Empire is that they don&#039;t electrify the Empire Connection from Penn Station to Spuyten Duyvil. Right now Amtrak runs diesel trains all the way, even on the parts of the Hudson Line that are already electrified.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The stupidest part about Empire is that they don&#8217;t electrify the Empire Connection from Penn Station to Spuyten Duyvil. Right now Amtrak runs diesel trains all the way, even on the parts of the Hudson Line that are already electrified.</p>
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		<title>By: Adirondacker</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/06/18/electrification-suddenly-in-vogue-again/#comment-1632</link>
		<dc:creator>Adirondacker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 19:31:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=2459#comment-1632</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;Why not electrify all of Caltrain&lt;/em&gt;

They will be, when California&#039;s HIgh Speed rail system is built. It would be ..... inefficient to electrify it now, rip it all out and re-electrify it in 5 years.

&lt;em&gt;and Empire Corridors&lt;/em&gt;

I&#039;m sure they have been toying with the idea since the line was electrified between Grand Central and Croton a hundred years ago. They even actually talk about it now and then. They never do anything....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>Why not electrify all of Caltrain</em></p>
<p>They will be, when California&#8217;s HIgh Speed rail system is built. It would be &#8230;.. inefficient to electrify it now, rip it all out and re-electrify it in 5 years.</p>
<p><em>and Empire Corridors</em></p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure they have been toying with the idea since the line was electrified between Grand Central and Croton a hundred years ago. They even actually talk about it now and then. They never do anything&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: lexslamman</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/06/18/electrification-suddenly-in-vogue-again/#comment-1631</link>
		<dc:creator>lexslamman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 08:19:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=2459#comment-1631</guid>
		<description>Why not electrify all of Caltrain and Empire Corridors (Start NOW), all of the Michigan, Illinois, and Hiawatha corridors, and the Surfliner corridor (Next), then the Cascades, Lincoln Service (CHI-STL), Virginia service (DC to Richmond/DC to Lynchburg/DC to Newport News) and Vermont/Inland Route - to Albany) third? I think doing it this way gives our emerging high-speed rail corridors a leg up they desperately need.

Intercity passenger rail should be electrified - higher power to weight ratio and regenerative breaking will make these trains energy efficient and give them better acceleration, making a positive impact on travel times.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why not electrify all of Caltrain and Empire Corridors (Start NOW), all of the Michigan, Illinois, and Hiawatha corridors, and the Surfliner corridor (Next), then the Cascades, Lincoln Service (CHI-STL), Virginia service (DC to Richmond/DC to Lynchburg/DC to Newport News) and Vermont/Inland Route &#8211; to Albany) third? I think doing it this way gives our emerging high-speed rail corridors a leg up they desperately need.</p>
<p>Intercity passenger rail should be electrified &#8211; higher power to weight ratio and regenerative breaking will make these trains energy efficient and give them better acceleration, making a positive impact on travel times.</p>
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		<title>By: Adirondacker</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/06/18/electrification-suddenly-in-vogue-again/#comment-1630</link>
		<dc:creator>Adirondacker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Jun 2009 17:26:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=2459#comment-1630</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;The technology may be there — or close&lt;/em&gt;

The technology has been there for decades. There were big swathes of freight moving with electricity in the US until a few decades ago. There still is some. Lots of freight in Europe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>The technology may be there — or close</em></p>
<p>The technology has been there for decades. There were big swathes of freight moving with electricity in the US until a few decades ago. There still is some. Lots of freight in Europe.</p>
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		<title>By: William Cassidy</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/06/18/electrification-suddenly-in-vogue-again/#comment-1625</link>
		<dc:creator>William Cassidy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Jun 2009 14:02:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=2459#comment-1625</guid>
		<description>A good discussion. Freight railroads, as you mention, are investigating electrification — but it&#039;s still a ways down the track.

In an interview outside the North American Rail Shippers Association annual meeting in Chicago last month, NS Executive Vice President and Chief Marketing Officer Donald W. Seale said “we’re having some discussion and review” about the potential to at some point electrify some track and trains, but “We at NS don’t see rail electrification in the near term” for freight.

The technology may be there — or close — but not the economics.

Rather than electrifying their long-haul routes, freight railroads may start by electrifying local rail yards.

See http://www.joc.com/node/411794 for more on this and links to a special report on freight rail electrification.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A good discussion. Freight railroads, as you mention, are investigating electrification — but it&#8217;s still a ways down the track.</p>
<p>In an interview outside the North American Rail Shippers Association annual meeting in Chicago last month, NS Executive Vice President and Chief Marketing Officer Donald W. Seale said “we’re having some discussion and review” about the potential to at some point electrify some track and trains, but “We at NS don’t see rail electrification in the near term” for freight.</p>
<p>The technology may be there — or close — but not the economics.</p>
<p>Rather than electrifying their long-haul routes, freight railroads may start by electrifying local rail yards.</p>
<p>See <a href="http://www.joc.com/node/411794" rel="nofollow">http://www.joc.com/node/411794</a> for more on this and links to a special report on freight rail electrification.</p>
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		<title>By: Joe Klein</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/06/18/electrification-suddenly-in-vogue-again/#comment-1627</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe Klein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 23:57:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=2459#comment-1627</guid>
		<description>With some creative modifications diesel-electric can have a pantograph and control electronics added for operation under overhead. I remember reading years ago of an electrified short line that equipped a standard diesel-electric switcher with a pantograph to save fuel costs when operating on the electrified segments.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>With some creative modifications diesel-electric can have a pantograph and control electronics added for operation under overhead. I remember reading years ago of an electrified short line that equipped a standard diesel-electric switcher with a pantograph to save fuel costs when operating on the electrified segments.</p>
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		<title>By: Adirondacker</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/06/18/electrification-suddenly-in-vogue-again/#comment-1628</link>
		<dc:creator>Adirondacker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Jun 2009 22:50:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thetransportpolitic.com/?p=2459#comment-1628</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;freight trains using the line would presumably also be required to convert their operations&lt;/em&gt;

They run three trains a day. Diesels can run under catenary. They would need at least two locomotives, one in service and one at the shop for inspection, maintenance or repairs. Not worth it unless they are electrifying other parts of the freight system. .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>freight trains using the line would presumably also be required to convert their operations</em></p>
<p>They run three trains a day. Diesels can run under catenary. They would need at least two locomotives, one in service and one at the shop for inspection, maintenance or repairs. Not worth it unless they are electrifying other parts of the freight system. .</p>
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