Comments on: Philadelphia Selects Waterfront Transit Alignment

By: Matt Fisher

Matt Fisher — Tue, 15 Jun 2010 01:18:35 +0000

Yes. In fact, I wish it was still the same as in 1953 for the most part. :)

By: Dean houck

Dean houck — Mon, 25 Jan 2010 10:24:28 +0000

I like the plans for the tram line ,I like to see more in the northeast part of philadelphia ,we need more lightrail in the northeast!Most cityies are going back to lightrails ,its a smart way to move people,buses seem to be replaces every few years ,light rails last much longer them buses,makes sence right? try it septa, comeone lets get moving now!
the 15 line is nice,I use it ,and love it ,thanks for bringing the trolly 15 back, I miss the 50,53,56,23,47.all are now buslines,think of the fule we can save, by putting trollyes back! by putting them back causes jobs,we need to go to lightrail now! thanks ,but who cares ? I do !dean houck

By: eldondre

eldondre — Fri, 30 Oct 2009 15:06:19 +0000

My biggest gripe is it’s south philly routing. rather than eventually meandering to the navy yard via unpopulated, industrial zones it should be running via a populated portion of lower south philly, perhaps as far as broad and oregon via moymensing. On the north side it simply goes nowhere. They could probably eliminate the entire northern portion and still hae the same riders with more frequent service. On the flip side, if you’re going to built it, it should run further. I just can’t see this portion generating any substantial ridership and will become an operating liability.

By: Tom Taggart

Tom Taggart — Wed, 28 Oct 2009 14:03:42 +0000

Chris et alia,

I agree with you, and hope they can extend this or another trolley service along the City Branch, or some other tunnel, to the Art Museum the Barnes, and maybe even Girard Avenue in that direction.

And yes, this will duplicate service for 6-7 Stops of the El, but I’m okay with that duplication for what I consider a huge improvement that a line along Delaware Avenue Brings. NewBoldPhilly, I think you have a great idea in takeing over Spring Garden street, and running a tram, light rail line, whatever you call it, but I wouldn’t take over the whole street (and that would never happen) but just two dedicated lanes in the middle, with less parking and a protected bike lane each way. The route they are proposing wouldn’t be as idiotic as the current bus lines, since it would have a more dedicated lane of travel.

All of you know about Septwatch’s blog, right? Look it up if not.

By: newboldphilly

newboldphilly — Wed, 28 Oct 2009 04:58:55 +0000

I think DRPA had this line in mind from the get-go. They’ve been talking about how – “all the major tourist destinations in the region all fall within a few blocks of a straight line from the Tweeter Center to the Art Museum” – for at least the last 7 years. They get to connect to the Speedline at 8th & Market, to their aerial “stonehenge on the Delaware” tram and they leave open the option for service down the Parkway.

What’s completely idiotic about all of this is, have none of these people seen the rush hour bus traffic on westbound Market St? It will take 20 minutes for these trolleys to go the 15 blocks from the river to City Hall.

As I’ve said in many other forums, public and private, build the waterfront alignment as they’ve shown but use Spring Garden St. to connect to the subway, the el, the Art Museum, and take it over the bridge into University City. Take it all the way down 40th St. to the trolley portal. Use the ALREADY EXISTING tracks and working trolley wire on 11th/12th Streets between Spring Garden and Bainbridge as a spur for the PATCO connection.

By: eldondre

eldondre — Wed, 28 Oct 2009 04:49:01 +0000

truncating the line at 2nd and franklin square woudl make it a two seat ride for tourists and a three seat ride for RRD riders.

By: thunda

thunda — Wed, 28 Oct 2009 01:52:02 +0000

This line is a total waste of money, but like much (most?) of the capital projects in this region, it’s primarily a political creation. In this case, DRPA is proposing something for the Pennsylvania side of the river because New Jersey is getting a new train line (which itself is a poor project that shouldn’t be funded in its current form).

Obviously, DRPA isn’t going spend its money on non-river projects, however worthy they might be (extending the BSL to the Navy Yard or under Ogontz Ave, extending the MFL to Roosevelt Blvd, the #100 spur to Valley Forge) but it could use that money to pay down its insanely high debt load. And remember, its debt is so high because its revenue is constantly raided by politicians in both states to pay for make-work projects of little value, much like this one.

By: Chris

Chris — Wed, 28 Oct 2009 01:45:48 +0000

Adding a streetcar along Market Street just duplicates service. Just running the streetcar along the Waterfront would be the better idea, with a connection at 2nd Street to the MFSE. The Franklin Square loop looked like a better option, because it allows for more potential for service.

I hope DRPA and SEPTA have some future thinking with this, with the potential of extending it westward to the Ben Franklin Parkway, either along it or under it in the City Branch Tunnel. Doing so will connect another transit strapped area, and actually make the streetcar go somewhere other than the casinos.

By: Brandi

Brandi — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 20:10:05 +0000

I think DRPA should either decide to make this either

1) A Tourist/Entertainment Line in which case it should go past city hall all the way up to the art museum to draw as many leisure users as possible. Then it will hit every daytime main tourist attraction and a lot of the night time ones along the waterfront.

2) A More Useful Line in which case it should either

A) Just run along the waterfront as an extension of the Girard Street and have a connection to the existing 2nd Street & Market Street stop on the Market Street Line to reduce costs.

B) Go underground at some point on its way down Market Street to connect to the Subway-Surface Lines and allow through routing of existing lines all the way to the waterfront. I have no clue if this is actually possible though.

C) Run down a different street then Market through the city to increase transit options for other less loved corridors.

Overall, though I have to say if DRPA can get anything new done even if it isn’t perfect it’ll be a heck of a lot better than what SEPTA has done in the last 30 years.

By: eldondre

eldondre — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 20:01:19 +0000

the whole thing is stupid. the Market st idea is better than the Franklin Sq idea but for half a billion dollars I’d rather see PATCO under the Parkway.