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	<title>Comments on: Improving Environmental Efficiencies in Transit</title>
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	<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/12/16/improving-environmental-efficiencies-in-transit/</link>
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		<title>By: Woody</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/12/16/improving-environmental-efficiencies-in-transit/#comment-218171</link>
		<dc:creator>Woody</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 May 2011 17:36:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/?p=4963#comment-218171</guid>
		<description>Perhaps the extreme example of this approach was Brasilia, a capital city planned by modernists in the mid-20th Century. It was constructed almost entirely of &quot;towers in the park&quot; housing districts. They are separated from the government (employment) district by a sprawling mess of wide boulevards that resemble limited-access freeways, with pedestrian crossings almost totally limited. 

But the city being in Brazil, the people who live there have been imposing their ideas of living onto the sterile framework, with kiosks and street vendors bringing life to empty sidewalks, and desire lines of pedestrian paths cutting thru vast open spaces designed to be left empty -- it&#039;s much like new vegetation breaking thru old concrete. And the outlying districts and suburbs, beyond the original city plan, are dense and lively.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps the extreme example of this approach was Brasilia, a capital city planned by modernists in the mid-20th Century. It was constructed almost entirely of &#8220;towers in the park&#8221; housing districts. They are separated from the government (employment) district by a sprawling mess of wide boulevards that resemble limited-access freeways, with pedestrian crossings almost totally limited. </p>
<p>But the city being in Brazil, the people who live there have been imposing their ideas of living onto the sterile framework, with kiosks and street vendors bringing life to empty sidewalks, and desire lines of pedestrian paths cutting thru vast open spaces designed to be left empty &#8212; it&#8217;s much like new vegetation breaking thru old concrete. And the outlying districts and suburbs, beyond the original city plan, are dense and lively.</p>
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		<title>By: Woody</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/12/16/improving-environmental-efficiencies-in-transit/#comment-218162</link>
		<dc:creator>Woody</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 May 2011 17:19:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/?p=4963#comment-218162</guid>
		<description>EngineerScotty, Racism is a large reason for, as you say, the &quot;segregation&quot; of commerce from suburban housing, IMHO. Many suburban developments in my old hometown and other cities in the former Confederacy are obviously trying to be gated communities without paying for the gates and guards. The aim is to keep out the riff-raff, especially the dark-skinned types. Of course, in commercial areas, dark-skinned people are present all the time, as employees and as customers. The bigots hope that by keeping &quot;those people&quot; away from their nice new homes and neighborhoods, they can maintain their lily-white lives. And looks like they succeed in that pretty well.

So I find it amusing that you blame the tendency to separate and segregate housing from other community functions on some anti-corporatism among the left. Because then how do you account for it in places like Texas where there is no left to speak of, but there&#039;s plenty of segregated and separated suburban housing?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>EngineerScotty, Racism is a large reason for, as you say, the &#8220;segregation&#8221; of commerce from suburban housing, IMHO. Many suburban developments in my old hometown and other cities in the former Confederacy are obviously trying to be gated communities without paying for the gates and guards. The aim is to keep out the riff-raff, especially the dark-skinned types. Of course, in commercial areas, dark-skinned people are present all the time, as employees and as customers. The bigots hope that by keeping &#8220;those people&#8221; away from their nice new homes and neighborhoods, they can maintain their lily-white lives. And looks like they succeed in that pretty well.</p>
<p>So I find it amusing that you blame the tendency to separate and segregate housing from other community functions on some anti-corporatism among the left. Because then how do you account for it in places like Texas where there is no left to speak of, but there&#8217;s plenty of segregated and separated suburban housing?</p>
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		<title>By: Araç Takip Sistemleri</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/12/16/improving-environmental-efficiencies-in-transit/#comment-217899</link>
		<dc:creator>Araç Takip Sistemleri</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 May 2011 09:25:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/?p=4963#comment-217899</guid>
		<description>I wonder which countries are really planning to invest in electric cars and charging stations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wonder which countries are really planning to invest in electric cars and charging stations.</p>
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		<title>By: Shower Pump&#160;</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/12/16/improving-environmental-efficiencies-in-transit/#comment-91649</link>
		<dc:creator>Shower Pump&#160;</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Oct 2010 21:19:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/?p=4963#comment-91649</guid>
		<description>electric motors are great, they really help keep manual jobs easier;,-</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>electric motors are great, they really help keep manual jobs easier;,-</p>
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		<title>By: Wad</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/12/16/improving-environmental-efficiencies-in-transit/#comment-21932</link>
		<dc:creator>Wad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Dec 2009 12:19:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/?p=4963#comment-21932</guid>
		<description>You&#039;re right, Alon, about the theme of a corporation going to a small town and basically controlling it with a choke chain.

That&#039;s one of the big reasons Nissan bailed on its California HQ. (A lot had to do with the South transplanting its way into prosperity, and Nissan did not have as many good years as did its former neighbors Honda and Toyota.)

Yet, the fascinating thing is that Nissan chose to replicate its big, desolate California HQ and make an enormous, desolate HQ in Tennessee.

I looked at Smyrna, TN in Bing&#039;s bird&#039;s-eye view, and that campus of Nissan&#039;s has several housing subdivisions near it. I can&#039;t say for sure whether those predated Nissan, but even if you were a worker that lived next door to the campus, you&#039;d still need a car to cross the perimeter.

Maybe Nissan is hard-up about corporate espionage. Honda and Toyota are also paranoid at their respective campuses. Yet that Nissan would embrace its desolation and grow it on a massive scale shows a reflection of its values and how it treats its employees and the community.

Here&#039;s a link to the aerial view of Nissan&#039;s former Gardena HQ:
http://tinyurl.com/ydaxht4

Interestingly, Nissan&#039;s neighbors include Metro&#039;s Division 18 bus yard immediately to the southeast, and the Goodyear Blimp launching area to the southeast of that.

Now for Smyrna:
http://tinyurl.com/ye2hjwl

I couldn&#039;t even use Bird&#039;s Eye at its most far out to capture the enormity of the Tennessee plant. You could fit whole college campuses on some of the larger parking lots there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re right, Alon, about the theme of a corporation going to a small town and basically controlling it with a choke chain.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s one of the big reasons Nissan bailed on its California HQ. (A lot had to do with the South transplanting its way into prosperity, and Nissan did not have as many good years as did its former neighbors Honda and Toyota.)</p>
<p>Yet, the fascinating thing is that Nissan chose to replicate its big, desolate California HQ and make an enormous, desolate HQ in Tennessee.</p>
<p>I looked at Smyrna, TN in Bing&#8217;s bird&#8217;s-eye view, and that campus of Nissan&#8217;s has several housing subdivisions near it. I can&#8217;t say for sure whether those predated Nissan, but even if you were a worker that lived next door to the campus, you&#8217;d still need a car to cross the perimeter.</p>
<p>Maybe Nissan is hard-up about corporate espionage. Honda and Toyota are also paranoid at their respective campuses. Yet that Nissan would embrace its desolation and grow it on a massive scale shows a reflection of its values and how it treats its employees and the community.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s a link to the aerial view of Nissan&#8217;s former Gardena HQ:<br />
<a href="http://tinyurl.com/ydaxht4" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/ydaxht4</a></p>
<p>Interestingly, Nissan&#8217;s neighbors include Metro&#8217;s Division 18 bus yard immediately to the southeast, and the Goodyear Blimp launching area to the southeast of that.</p>
<p>Now for Smyrna:<br />
<a href="http://tinyurl.com/ye2hjwl" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/ye2hjwl</a></p>
<p>I couldn&#8217;t even use Bird&#8217;s Eye at its most far out to capture the enormity of the Tennessee plant. You could fit whole college campuses on some of the larger parking lots there.</p>
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		<title>By: Alon Levy</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/12/16/improving-environmental-efficiencies-in-transit/#comment-21840</link>
		<dc:creator>Alon Levy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Dec 2009 06:10:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/?p=4963#comment-21840</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think Nissan got to rewrite zoning laws in the South Bay. I think the main moral of the story of Nissan in Smyrna is less &quot;Nissan is against mixed-use urbanism&quot; and more &quot;company towns are miserable places to live in because corporations have no problem engaging in government-style restrictions, without the usual democratic checks.&quot; I mean, this is nothing the US didn&#039;t see in the age of Pullman and Ford.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think Nissan got to rewrite zoning laws in the South Bay. I think the main moral of the story of Nissan in Smyrna is less &#8220;Nissan is against mixed-use urbanism&#8221; and more &#8220;company towns are miserable places to live in because corporations have no problem engaging in government-style restrictions, without the usual democratic checks.&#8221; I mean, this is nothing the US didn&#8217;t see in the age of Pullman and Ford.</p>
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		<title>By: Wad</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/12/16/improving-environmental-efficiencies-in-transit/#comment-21835</link>
		<dc:creator>Wad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Dec 2009 04:49:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/?p=4963#comment-21835</guid>
		<description>Alon Levy wrote:

&lt;i&gt;Nissan forced Smyrna, Tennessee to zone the land it was going to build its factory on as industrial-only, on the grounds that commercial development would distract its workers.&lt;/i&gt;

It&#039;s repeating the same behavior when Nissan was headquarted in Southern California. (It didn&#039;t have an auto plant, though).

Japan&#039;s Big 3 automakers were within 3.5 miles of one another in the South Bay of Los Angeles.

Honda and Toyota are practically next-door neighbors. Honda, though, has its headquarters across the street from Old Torrance, a streetcar-era walkable Main Street historic district. It&#039;s more of a drive for Toyota workers, though.

Nissan, on the other hand, was on the other side of the 110 freeway with nothing but a parking lot surrounding it. When Nissan vacated the space, the office real estate agent struggled to find a buyer because of the desolation of the HQ building.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alon Levy wrote:</p>
<p><i>Nissan forced Smyrna, Tennessee to zone the land it was going to build its factory on as industrial-only, on the grounds that commercial development would distract its workers.</i></p>
<p>It&#8217;s repeating the same behavior when Nissan was headquarted in Southern California. (It didn&#8217;t have an auto plant, though).</p>
<p>Japan&#8217;s Big 3 automakers were within 3.5 miles of one another in the South Bay of Los Angeles.</p>
<p>Honda and Toyota are practically next-door neighbors. Honda, though, has its headquarters across the street from Old Torrance, a streetcar-era walkable Main Street historic district. It&#8217;s more of a drive for Toyota workers, though.</p>
<p>Nissan, on the other hand, was on the other side of the 110 freeway with nothing but a parking lot surrounding it. When Nissan vacated the space, the office real estate agent struggled to find a buyer because of the desolation of the HQ building.</p>
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		<title>By: Alon Levy</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/12/16/improving-environmental-efficiencies-in-transit/#comment-21743</link>
		<dc:creator>Alon Levy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Dec 2009 20:45:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/?p=4963#comment-21743</guid>
		<description>ES: the separation of commercial and residential uses is much newer than the Victorian era. It comes from early 20th century modernist reformers, who viewed mixed-used neighborhoods as a mess. Proper order should consist of clearly defined separate spaces for living, working, and playing; since at the time industrial pollution was a major problem for neighborhoods, this seemed like common sense.

It&#039;s not anti-corporatism - the people who believed in this view were often patrician Progressives. In fact, in a recent example of separate-use zoning, Nissan forced Smyrna, Tennessee to zone the land it was going to build its factory on as industrial-only, on the grounds that commercial development would distract its workers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ES: the separation of commercial and residential uses is much newer than the Victorian era. It comes from early 20th century modernist reformers, who viewed mixed-used neighborhoods as a mess. Proper order should consist of clearly defined separate spaces for living, working, and playing; since at the time industrial pollution was a major problem for neighborhoods, this seemed like common sense.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s not anti-corporatism &#8211; the people who believed in this view were often patrician Progressives. In fact, in a recent example of separate-use zoning, Nissan forced Smyrna, Tennessee to zone the land it was going to build its factory on as industrial-only, on the grounds that commercial development would distract its workers.</p>
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		<title>By: EngineerScotty</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/12/16/improving-environmental-efficiencies-in-transit/#comment-21738</link>
		<dc:creator>EngineerScotty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Dec 2009 18:25:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/?p=4963#comment-21738</guid>
		<description>A big component of modern suburb design, and one which is probably ill-conceived, consists of Trying To Get Traffic Out of the Neighborhood.  Many suburban dwellers want streets with little traffic, and they way they accomplish this end is to make them dead-end, and channel through traffic onto the collectors and arterials.

A second effect of this desire is the removal and segregation of commerce (the latter effect is no doubt aided and abetted by a &quot;commerce is ugly, if not evil&quot; ethic in some parts of the population)--many people seem to hold the view that living in proximity to business is inappropriate or substandard.  I&#039;m not sure where this view comes from--it seems to be a mixture of Victorian standards of propriety, and anti-corporatiism among some parts of the left--but it&#039;s there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A big component of modern suburb design, and one which is probably ill-conceived, consists of Trying To Get Traffic Out of the Neighborhood.  Many suburban dwellers want streets with little traffic, and they way they accomplish this end is to make them dead-end, and channel through traffic onto the collectors and arterials.</p>
<p>A second effect of this desire is the removal and segregation of commerce (the latter effect is no doubt aided and abetted by a &#8220;commerce is ugly, if not evil&#8221; ethic in some parts of the population)&#8211;many people seem to hold the view that living in proximity to business is inappropriate or substandard.  I&#8217;m not sure where this view comes from&#8211;it seems to be a mixture of Victorian standards of propriety, and anti-corporatiism among some parts of the left&#8211;but it&#8217;s there.</p>
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		<title>By: Ocean Railroader</title>
		<link>http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/2009/12/16/improving-environmental-efficiencies-in-transit/#comment-21521</link>
		<dc:creator>Ocean Railroader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 22:15:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thetransportpolitic.com/?p=4963#comment-21521</guid>
		<description>Some of the car based suburbs can be very wastfull that it can be very funny some times how they are laid out. A lot of streets in the suburbs of Richmond are that you a house that&#039;s only 1/4 a mile away from a store but the way the subdivsions and their dead end Cul de sacks are laid out you could easlly go 1 to 3 miles to go that 1/4 mile to get from one place or another. Sometimes you will even see two streets across a 20 foot empty grassy strip that you would have to drive two to three miles to get to from one subivsion to another. I think I would like to see some of the Cul de sacks opened up to tie into other streets like in the city of Richmond. The car traffic in the city of Richmond looks like it&#039;s not funneled onto one main highway that&#039;s jamed with cars like in the suburbs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some of the car based suburbs can be very wastfull that it can be very funny some times how they are laid out. A lot of streets in the suburbs of Richmond are that you a house that&#8217;s only 1/4 a mile away from a store but the way the subdivsions and their dead end Cul de sacks are laid out you could easlly go 1 to 3 miles to go that 1/4 mile to get from one place or another. Sometimes you will even see two streets across a 20 foot empty grassy strip that you would have to drive two to three miles to get to from one subivsion to another. I think I would like to see some of the Cul de sacks opened up to tie into other streets like in the city of Richmond. The car traffic in the city of Richmond looks like it&#8217;s not funneled onto one main highway that&#8217;s jamed with cars like in the suburbs.</p>
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